Best Heel Promo you've ever heard?

[PerfectTommy]

Was surfing Youtube and came across this one, which is IMO, the best heel promo ever given. The crowd damn near rioted- in a good way. LOL.

Part 1:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wac6YXYC91Q

Part 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiQfa6izIJk

What's your favorite heel promo?

[Andrew Xavier]

The first ever cutting Edge. Edge had soooooooooooooooo much heat and I honestly believed vince was trying to take him off the air. I will try and find the clip.

[Chazz]

Hulk Hogan, when he turned on the fans at Bash at the Beach in 96, and he ended with....."You guys can stick it....brother!"......or something like that. The fans threw trash into the ring, but Hulk just played along and cut an awesome promo.

[JDK]

HBK's promo in Montreal wasn't half bad either. Where he teased Bret's return by playing the 'Hart Attack' music.

[APostingGod]

Mick Foley attacking Ric Flair.

[The Kid]

I'm sure there's better, but first two that come to mind:

CM Punk Promo on Raven from ROH show
http://www.tv.com/uservideos/?action=video_player&id=dXMxlmD-5bkEszfb

And Mick Foley "Cane Dewey" Promo in ECW
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1oaxe

[Andrew Xavier]

Heres that video I talked about...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSDZ3gG7ojc

[D2Kvirus]

CM Punk's "The Old man and the Snake" promo at Death efore Dishonor III was gold on so many levels: not only did he go from being the top face to uber heel in one promo, but the way it played kayfabe was beautiful - it was supposed to be his last night in the company and his last chance to be ROH champ befor ehe handed it back to be won in an eight-man tourney (which was the story behind Paul London's last match with Joe for the title at the first DBD), but instead he kept hold of the belt and threatened to take it to the WWE with him.

The next show played on this more, as he signed his WWE contract on the ROH belt.

[APostingGod]

I once thought this was the WWE forum, sigh.

[D2Kvirus]

I once thought this was the WWE forum, sigh.

It's General Wrestling, so no.

[Scorch]

It was originally in the WWE forum, until somebody had to move it when people kept referencing promos from outside the WWE.

As for what I think is the best heel promo, I ever saw, not really sure to be honest. To me a great heel promo needs to do a few things. Not only should it increase dislike for the heel, it should increase my like of a face, push a program or angle, and leave me hoping to see the heel get what they have coming to them. It also needs to capture the attention of the audience.

One of the more enjoyable ones I saw was the Age of the Fall birth promo by Jimmy Jacobs. However, most of the rest of the crowd rejected it then, so I would not class it as best heel promo I heard. Still as he spoke, with one of the Briscoe's blood pouring onto him (I can never remember if it was Jay or Mark, I want to say Jay) it did everything it should. It built up the Briscoes, it made you despise this new group, you wanted to see them get destroyed, and you knew it would happen if they ever had a fair fight.

That was the first time I saw the Punk promo on Raven and while nice, I would not classify it as a great heel promo, because I find too much logic in what he says for it to really build up my hatred of Punk and want to see Raven destroy him. It was a good emotional promo, but I think there is subtext that is only there for the ROH crowd at the time.

[D2Kvirus]

Jay was doing the bleeding - however, I disagree with the AOTF formation promo as a good one, as most of the heat was one of two phrases: "Boring" or "Shut the fuck up." ROH crowds are sick and tired of AOTF these days, as well as dreading any wins in case it subjects them to yet another Jimmy Jacobs promo where he takes five minutes to say what a great promo guy will say in 30 seconds.

As for Punk's promos on Raven, I always like the "This is Straightedge" one at Wrestlerave. And, although it wasn't a heel promo as such, Mick Foley ripping into Ric Flair at Punk vs. Joe II was gold: "I'm no Ric Flair because I never carried batista's bag. I'm no Ric Flair because I never kissed Triple H's ass. I'm no Ric Flair because I never did stupid things like...this *does Flair Flop*."

Hey, it made him a heel to Ric Flair and his hangers-on club, despite having a whole hell of a lot of home truths in it.

[Scorch]

Actually you agree with me on the AOTF promo, since I specifically cited the audience reaction as to why it was flawed. Not having seen any ROH since the last time they were in Chicago Ridge, I cannot say how other parts of the country have been responding to them, but the group is over in Chicago. Fans respond well to Necro and Tyler, and everyone loves to hate Jacobs. The biggest problem they originally had was the shrieking used instead of theme music. That had people dreading their appearances, at least in Chicago, since that was dropped people more enjoy seeing them work, hoping each time Jimmy will get destroyed.

I remember the Foley promo on Flair and that, given the crowd, was a face promo.

[D2Kvirus]

Compared to the Emolution formation, Alex Shelley's promo at the birth of Generation Next was mor eor less perfect. Indeed, just about every promo he cut on that one show (he had at least three, if not more) and each of them got over the group and Shelley's assholish character instantly. True, there were a couple of chants of "It's not over" when they came out to face down the Briscoes, but they sure as hell were after the GenNext vs. Briscoes, Walters & Rave match, and got progressivly more over afterwards.

The heat Jacobs gets is less legit heat, more "Please stop talking" heat (a chant received by Roderick Strong last year, as his promos are terrible). Indeed, both Jacobs and Strong are poor choices to lead a faction, die to their lack of charisma or tangiable promo skills. This is why Sweet n Sour Inc. have made an impact with the crowd: Larry Sweeney and Chris Hero are both great promo guys and have the charisma to pull it off. Hell, I'd go as far as to say Strong was the weakest on promos of the three NRC members.

[Mike Adams]

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[The Kid]

To be fair, ROH fans are fucking retards who always chant over heels and don't understand wrestling that isn't a million high spots an hour. If ROH wants to move forward, they must do so at the expense of their fanbase, who won't allow anything other than in ring action to define the company.

[D2Kvirus]

To be fair, ROH fans are fucking retards who always chant over heels and don't understand wrestling that isn't a million high spots an hour. If ROH wants to move forward, they must do so at the expense of their fanbase, who won't allow anything other than in ring action to define the company.

The award for using cliches that haven't had relevance since 2004 goes to you.

[The Kid]

Is there an award for being willfully ignorant? ROH's booking style, which caters to their fans perfectly, is not one that will ever get over to any real degree. Their reluctance to follow a face-heel divide, along with their insistance on booking shitty wrestlers like Albright and Romero insures they'll be Indy forever. I mean assuming they survive longer than this year.

[Mike Adams]

excuse me? did you just call brent albright and rocky romero shitty wrestlers?


fail, sir.

epic fail.

[The Kid]

Wow, are you going to defend them as anything more than the two worst on their roster?

[Scorch]

I will certainly defend Albright, given that I can see him as being a future ROH Champion. The fans really got behind him early in his tenure, and he stayed over as a heel, until his recent turn when he split from Sweet 'n Sour Inc. I have not watched his matches thinking "wow, this suck" but that to me is not why I defend him. I defend him based on how over the man is with the fanbase at the shows I have been to, and watched through either the videowires or DVDs.

[D2Kvirus]

Is there an award for being willfully ignorant?

If there is, step up onto the podium. Seriously...


ROH's booking style, which caters to their fans perfectly, is not one that will ever get over to any real degree. Their reluctance to follow a face-heel divide,

WRONG.

It's clear who the faces and the heels are: Nigel McGuinness, AOTF and Sweet n Sour Inc are all clearly heels, along with the likes of Rhett Titus, the YRR and, on the face of it, Eddie Kingston.

The rest of the roster are faces.

Yes, they may have been the home of face vs. face Indy Dream Matches - back in 2003.


along with their insistance on booking shitty wrestlers like Albright and Romero insures they'll be Indy forever. I mean assuming they survive longer than this year.

And at that point you prove your maturity and intellect are at the same level. That sound you can hear is the sound of you scraping the bottom of the barrel trying to come up with an argument, and coming across as an ass.

[Mike Adams]

albright will probably the roh champion by the end of the year at the latest march or april of 09 and rocky romero is still a really talented worker, his mike skills leave a lot to be desired as do albright's but still questioning their workrate is pretty ignorant.....and even if you are correct in saying that they are the worst 2 roh workers that still puts them better than 60% or so of the wwe roster and about 35% of the tna roster

[The Kid]

Umm, the Romero and Albright thing is hardly a unique viewpoint. Okay, so there is a clear divide between faces and heels eh?

Last show I watched was Bedlam in Beantown or something from earlier this year in Boston.


*SPOILERS BELOW*








The Opening match was a 4 corner survival or whatever, which had Rocky Romero vs. Strong vs. Stevens vs. Generico. Granted, a good portion of the fans actually did sort of get on NRC, although it for the most part was through chanting and the like. That being said, the fans cheered for pretty much all of the heels' spots. Add to this Romero was doing fucking Lucha spots trying to get the crowd to pop, which speaks to his shittyness. Romero isn't a wrestler, he's a collection of spots.

Next match was Jason Blade vs. Some local guy. Blade's part of the YRR, so I guess he's the heel here, although both worked face the whole match. Anyway, crowd pops for both, chants/claps for both, yeah.

Next up comes Jigsaw vs. Eddie Edwards. Both worked face until the very end. Dueling chants, cheering for both. Sweeney comes out to interupt the match, to which he gets a face pop.

Next match is Briscoes vs. Vulture Squad. Briscoes are maybe the biggest faces in the company. Vulture Squad are a top face team as well. Fans react accordingly.

Next, Sara Del Ray vs. Daizee Haze, booked to be face vs. face, match gets interupted by Sweeney, so that's cool. Gets a little shut the fuck up chant, but when he actually does talk gets fans to pop several times by attempting to be a heel.

This transitions into Sweeney, Hero and Albright vs. Castagnoli, Delirious and Pelle Primeau. Fans were pretty much straight up, to their credit. Chris Hero, however got alternating "Let's go Hero, fuck you Hero chants" and later a "Chris is Awesome" chant. Sweeney got cheered after getting the first pin as well, but hardly a huge pop.

Davey Richards, who's character playing is getting alot better vs. Kota Ibushi up next. Richards, worked heel got pops several times throughout the match, after the match was cheered far more than booed. Post match standing ovation for both men.

Nigel vs. Stevens up next. Nigel with a fair sized pop upon entering. Nigel with some pre-match heeling, which seems to get the crowd against him. Immediately following his insulting of the crowd, McGuiness recieves a "Let's go Nigel" chant, although it doesn't appear to be from a large portion of the fans. Nigel picks up the win and the fans do their whole golf clap bullshit for his win. Cheer a little. No real boos.

Necro vs. Steen in the main event. Necro, working heel, gets the biggest pop of the night to this point. Fans cheered both men throughout. Huge Necro Butcher chant post match.

I'm sure you're going to argue this show is an anomoly and that's cool. Those who look at the world with their eyes closed will never see anything wrong.

[D2Kvirus]

Allow me to make something abundantly clear to you, as you don't appear to have grasped it and invalidated your own so-called argument: just because fans cheer the heels, that does not mean there is no clear face/heel divide.

When fans were cheering the likes of HHH, Angle, The Rock or Jericho, did that mean there was no clear face/heel divide in WWE?

*crickets*

You would've been better off finishing the Idiotic Dumark Comment Set by saying ROH play shows in high school gyyms in front of less than 500 fans, because that's what you've been saying for the rest of this thread - which is remarkably off-topic, too.

As for Albright, he seems to turn it on either on the big shows, the big matches, or in front of hot crowds - not unlike many other OVW graduates, especially Cena, Carlito and Nitro/Morrison. Meanwhile, if Romero was so bad, how comes he was picked to play Black Tiger IV in New Japan?

Please stop responding, because you patently have no idea about a damn thing you're talking about.

[The Kid]

My point is that ROH fans ruin the product, so how does the fans cheering heels not add to my point? And Romero being bad has like very little impact on him being chosen as a fucking guy behind a mask. New Japan wouldn't employ any bad wrestlers right?

[Duff]

On Topic gents

[APostingGod]

Oh it's a good discussion, let them go.

[Duff]

i agree that it's a good discussion, but it isn't anything that's remotely related to the original topic, which i still feel can generate a good discussion itself. Therefore, if we split this, we get two good discussions, and not one.

[The Kid]

LOL, the one time I can get some actual discussion going this happens. Lets face it, this shit even being in general wrestling turns it from a thread people respond to to something that won't get any fucking attention.

[D2Kvirus]

LOL, the one time I can get some actual discussion going this happens. Lets face it, this shit even being in general wrestling turns it from a thread people respond to to something that won't get any fucking attention.

If you consider having people point out your ignorance, whilst you manage to invalidate your own so-called points,an actual discussion, you're clearly mad. That'd be like me dissing WWE by saying evolution take up too much of the shows and A-Train is a shitty worker - valid points in 2003, completely irrelevant in 2008.

Your "reasons" for justbeing a dumark flaming ROH whilst knowing nothing about it are the reasons it got moved to General Wrestling, too. I quoted heel promos from other promotions, as did Chazz before me and Scorchafterwards. Youstarted with this:
"To be fair, ROH fans are fucking retards who always chant over heels and don't understand wrestling that isn't a million high spots an hour. If ROH wants to move forward, they must do so at the expense of their fanbase, who won't allow anything other than in ring action to define the company."

How is that:
1.) On topic
2.) Relevant
3.) Accurate

[The Kid]

It was on topic because I was referring to fans chanting over Jimmy Jacob's in-ring promo which made it difficult to even hear what he was saying. It is difficult to progress storylines when your fans are chanting over the wrestlers trying to cut promos. As for me not knowing anything about ROH, I've seen every show, so I mean I don't think ignorance is the problem.

It was on topic because I was offering a critique of a promo contained in the thread, it was relevant because of the same reason, and it was accurate because for the most parts the fans destroy the heel-face divide that wrestling is for the most part based on. I think it's fair to say that to move beyond the point where they're at now, such mustn't be the case, and that an evolved fanbase must exist.

Of course that doesn't guarentee anything and if ROH wants to move past the point they're at now they also need changes to their product, but that's a whole other conversation.

[Duff]

It was on topic because I was referring to fans chanting over Jimmy Jacob's in-ring promo which made it difficult to even hear what he was saying. It is difficult to progress storylines when your fans are chanting over the wrestlers trying to cut promos. As for me not knowing anything about ROH, I've seen every show, so I mean I don't think ignorance is the problem.

It was on topic because I was offering a critique of a promo contained in the thread, it was relevant because of the same reason, and it was accurate because for the most parts the fans destroy the heel-face divide that wrestling is for the most part based on. I think it's fair to say that to move beyond the point where they're at now, such mustn't be the case, and that an evolved fanbase must exist.

Of course that doesn't guarentee anything and if ROH wants to move past the point they're at now they also need changes to their product, but that's a whole other conversation.

logic for being on topic accepted. Please continue :D

[The Kid]

I heart u Duffy :)

[D2Kvirus]

It was on topic because I was referring to fans chanting over Jimmy Jacob's in-ring promo which made it difficult to even hear what he was saying. It is difficult to progress storylines when your fans are chanting over the wrestlers trying to cut promos. As for me not knowing anything about ROH, I've seen every show, so I mean I don't think ignorance is the problem.

They were chanting over it because they were right - Jacobs always takes ten minutes to cut a thirty second promo, and it was killing the visual. In fact, the wrestlers they usually chant over, i.e. Jacobs and Roderick Strong, can't cut a promo to save their lives and, in the case of Jacobs, he kills vast amounts of time.

Of course, you never hear WWE fans chanting "boring" over anyone's promo, do you? Ergo, you're still irrelevant.


It was on topic because I was offering a critique of a promo contained in the thread, it was relevant because of the same reason, and it was accurate because for the most parts the fans destroy the heel-face divide that wrestling is for the most part based on. I think it's fair to say that to move beyond the point where they're at now, such mustn't be the case, and that an evolved fanbase must exist.

No, myself and (Scorch?) offered a critique. You offered a flame, and continue to do so.

Also, it does not kill their face/heel divide - you know, the thing you said didn't exist three or four posts back - because the booking and the commentary put them over as heels and, I repeat, WWE fans have cheered for the likes of HHH, Angle, The Rock, Jericho and Austin when they wer eheels, just like TNA fans cheer for Angle, Christian Cage, Joe and AJ when they're heels. So, where is your fair and balanced comments on that then?


Of course that doesn't guarentee anything and if ROH wants to move past the point they're at now they also need changes to their product, but that's a whole other conversation.

If they need to change anything, they need to stop second-guessing themselves to appease dumarks who want to bash the company for the sake of it, because they can't quite accept how bacd WWE or TNA are.

THAT'S a whole different conversation, but you're trying to drag it in that direction.

[The Kid]

LOL okay.

[Aperama]

It was on topic because I was

WHAT


referring to fans chanting over Jimmy Jacob's in-ring promo which made it difficult to even hear what he was say

WHAT


ing. It is difficult to progress storylines when your fans are chanting over the

WHAT


wrestlers trying to cut promos. As for me not knowing anything about ROH,

WHAT


've seen every show, so I mean I don't think ignorance is the problem.

Sorry, dude - but you're really picking on straws here, imo. Well.. anyway.

I'm going to pick something that.. well, it's probably not the actual best, but it's really something that's stood out from everything else of its ilk I've ever seen.

The Raw before.. I think, Vengeance 2006. Mick Foley's hyping up his match against Ric Flair at the PPV. And instead of saying how he was going to win.. he said.. I'm going to prove you exactly right, Ric. I'm going to have the worst match you've ever been in. It's going to be two out of three falls, and you're going to be ashamed of this match. This is going to be the absolute worst POS you've ever been in, Flair.

I was in tears, it was so perfect.

[The Kid]

Umm what?

[Aperama]

That stupid Stone Cold thing. Which is, for all intents and purposes, pretty much the exact same as chanting through a promo, is it not?

Don't get me wrong. I think the 'What?' thing is terrible. At the same time.. WWE fans are still doing it. How can you say 'ROH fans are stupid for..' when WWE fans are doing the exact same thing, unprovoked? Most of the newer guys still haven't worked out how to work around the 'WHAT?' chants, either.

[The Kid]

Oh I'm not saying that shit isn't stupid as fuck, but shit doesn't change the mind of a fan who thinks "I paid good money for this ticket, and I can cheer who I want". Motherfuckers like this don't realize, wrestling isn't fucking real. Boo the fucking heels and cheer the faces.

[APostingGod]

D2K calm down with the name calling and personal attacks, it's unnecessary, and you just look like you are bullying your point.

You need a hug....

Wheres Sunny?

Anyways, you ladies continue...

(I know I'm not a mod anymore, but I still hold power over you all Muahahaha)

[D2Kvirus]

Seriously, just give it up - you're sounding like a 13 year old having a tantrum now.

[Snowman]

Yeah, anyway...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ydZDLLtp8Y
Maybe not the BEST heel promo in the world but I loved how Kurt Angle handled the situation of the fans refusing to accept him as a heel and just cheering him like mad no matter what he did. I remember that like it was yesterday and I actually RESPECTED the E for not ignoring the fans and just continuing the storyline anyway.

Remember the Mexicools trying to be heels when they first entered SD? They kept trying to do heelish attacks on everyone but the fans just cheered like mad. Every week it would get worse and worse and it took the E about a month or so to actually make the face turn.

[The Kid]

I think that that last promo was an excellent piece of heelery. I like how Angle was able to touch on themes of racism, nationalism and religion in one piece.

America's rich us vs. them philosophy lead to a great deal of xenophobia towards the French during that time period. The hatred was so deep that trivial things like French fries were changed to freedom fries. In stark contrast to this antipathy, Angle stresses that France is the best country on Earth, a viewpoint sure to earn the hatred of the fans at large.

The similar philosophy of always supporting the troops makes Angle's, I hope America loses the war line becomes a particularly pugent viewpoint.

America's predisposition to believe in the Christian doctrine makes a villian of anyone who dares speak out against it. Angle did so in this promo, sure to draw the ire of the people at large.

Angle also discusses one of the darkest and cruellest of viewpoints when he says he doesn't like black people. For a country still shaken by the evils of racism, any racist viewpoint is viewed in popular society as one of the greatest expressions of evil and an overall ignominious thing to say.

This promo is everything that should be used for garnering hatred. The only thing I would add is the classic your local sports team sucks. Oh what a life changing moment that was indeed. I hope this long, well thought out post will encourage discussion of these intensely powerfull themes. Thank you all.

[Cripplerlock]

This promo is everything that should be used for garnering hatred. The only thing I would add is the classic your local sports team sucks. Oh what a life changing moment that was indeed. I hope this long, well thought out post will encourage discussion of these intensely powerfull themes. Thank you all.

Well I guess I will have to check out Angle's promo a little later. However, lets hit the pause button before this ends up going on a huge non wrestling tangent. Good discussion topics but unles it can be contained within the boundaries of wrestling (which I can probably tell you from experience will not happen), this thread may become the first WP migrating thread. <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[The Kid]

My whole last post was for the most part sarcastic. The promo wasn't anything amazing, just a cute little promo.